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| Israel-Palestine | ||
| Palestinian farmland taken for Israeli wall | ||
| 2004-06-15 | ||
JERUSALEM. Israel has expropriated thousands of acres of Palestinian farmland deep in the West Bank for the most controversial segment of its separation barrier, Palestinian officials said Monday. The latest land seizures are for a barrier segment near the Israeli settlement of Ariel, in the heart of the West Bank.
The United States is opposed to adding Ariel to Israeli territory by means of the barrier, and Israel has so far avoided making a clear decision. Asaf Shariv, Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's spokesman, said that for now, only an east-west section of the barrier is being built, leaving the option of encircling Ariel separately, a concept the Americans apparently do not oppose.
Despite the tension, the military began easing restrictions in the West Bank, starting to remove about 40 ramparts and gates that blocked West Bank roads, a defense official said on condition of anonymity. The official said obstacles can be lifted in areas where the barrier has been completed. The military released a statement saying the removal is in keeping with its policy to "to make a clear distinction between the terrorists who hide among civilians and those not involved in terror." | ||
| Posted by:Steve White |
| #36 Bowelmotionmoron I never said Jews were evil. |
| Posted by: Antiwar 2004-06-15 1:43:12 PM |
| #35 Interesting isn't it how a mere few years after they had left (fill in name of concentration camp here) the Zionists tortured and killed the Palestinians. How those once persecuted now are the persecutors. |
| Posted by: Antiwar 2004-06-15 1:20:04 PM |
| #34 Maybe you should read it Frank (and everyone) |
| Posted by: Antiwar 2004-06-15 1:05:03 PM |
| #33 I have just been reading voices of Palestine VERY interesting website. |
| Posted by: Antiwar 2004-06-15 12:53:07 PM |
| #32 I'm willing to recommit the pigskin death shroud concept to F*&k with their little peabrain Islamic minds and immortality |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-06-15 9:41:43 PM |
| #31 Thank you, Frank G. I agree entirely. The Islamic martyr mentality may well be nearly impossible for western cultures to comprehend or overcome. I can only suppose the terrorists cheerfully dispose of such human shields (i.e., women and children) confident that their victims will enter paradise after being used so cruelly. (I will add that it took me about 30 seconds to conclude that soldiers confronted with opponents using human shields must immediately fire into such combatants. The inability to do so permits the most virulent enemy faction to continue such asymmetrically leveraged assaults. Once innocent people realize that being used in such a way represents certain death, they learn to will resist. If they do not, they are merely abetting such fiendishness) It is almost impossible to counteract martyrdom's sort of viral meme (i.e., self-propagating concept), save by exterminating it. Our reluctance to necessarily exceed such ruthlessness in the course of combating it may well prove our downfall. I can only assume that this is one of the gating aspects of Islam's potency. Cultures unable to surpass the viciousness of Islamist belligerents are simply overwhelmed by such brutality. Those that can exceed such barbarity may just as often self-destruct after becoming infected with such savagery. I will freely admit that this is why my own stance regarding jihadist Islam often comes across as so vitriolic. I see no other way than by direct and fierce subjugation to quell this sort of irrationality. The simple alternative of coexistence or extinction must be presented to Islam in unambiguous terms. Whether many people wish to admit it or not, Islam already has adopted this posture. It is the root of their martyrdom complex and we must needs be accommodate their desire to enter paradise if they are unwilling to let us find our own way to whatever hereafter we envision. |
| Posted by: Zenster 2004-06-15 8:55:08 PM |
| #30 waaaalll there definitely was a typo there. My intent was to say that the Paleos take the virtue of the Israeli side for granted (i.e.: human shields), whereas it's a given, if the Paleo terrorists can execute women and children and infants (who don't shoot back) - they take that in a nanosecond, because they're |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-06-15 8:08:05 PM |
| #29 #28 but I think only the worst of Paleo supporters woul deny they've shown restraint the other side avows not to show Frank G, you want to clarify on that one? I think there may be a double negative or Israel / Palestine mix-up in there somewhere. |
| Posted by: Zenster 2004-06-15 7:49:55 PM |
| #28 In addition, a civilian population that knowingly harbors terrorists loses their "innocent" status. I don't condone wanton destruction by any means, but I think only the worst of Paleo supporters woul deny they've shown restraint the other side avows not to show |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-06-15 7:24:44 PM |
| #27 The Israelis were, and are, absolute shits, at times. And the Paleos are worse. I appreciated your post. Sawt al-Shebaab and ex-lib, I too have been concerned about how close Israeli tactics approach (or duplicate) terrorist techniques. The concept of collective punishment is something the Nazis used against my Danish mother's family. There remains a few things that definitely offset Israeli use of such tactics. 1.) The Israelis do not have as an avowed political goal the destruction of all Arab states and the extermination of all Arab people. 2.) Perhaps, most telling of all, there are mosques in Israel. The synagogues in all of the other Arab nations could probably be counted on your fingers (if at all). It is easy to indulge in moral relativism, but the Palestinians go well beyond the pale in so many different respects that they repudiate their own rights as human beings. Needless to say that it is uncomfortable to talk about human beings in such terms, but the depravity seen on a regular basis must be used as a guideline for judging right and wrong. Too often, the Palestinians simply come out on the "wrong" side of the equation. |
| Posted by: Zenster 2004-06-15 7:11:20 PM |
| #26 Interesting isn't it how a mere few years after they had left (fill in name of concentration camp here) the Zionists.. BZZZZZZZZZZZZTTTTTT!!!!! Game over. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2004-06-15 6:13:15 PM |
| #25 #10 Interesting isn't it how a mere few years after they had left (fill in name of concentration camp here) the Zionists tortured and killed the Palestinians. How those once persecuted now are the persecutors. Posted by: Antiwar I think it's more interesting that you, yourself, Pakistani Princess Antiwar, support terrorism against anyone, anywhere, by your friends, the jihadis. And let's not forget you wished cancer on me on this website after you refused to speak against Palestinian idiots throwing rocks at jewish kindegarteners . Don't preach to others about so-called "persecutors" until you decide that you're going to live up to your own "name" of "Antiwar." Until then, be honest, change it to "Pro-jihad." Everybody knows you are anyway. (BTW, your credibility here, is completely gone--vanished a long time ago. I suggest you do the same.) Sawt al-Shebaab: Yeah. The Israelis were, and are, absolute shits, at times. And the Paleos are worse. I appreciated your post. |
| Posted by: ex-lib 2004-06-15 4:48:21 PM |
| #24 Mucky is a metaphysical Christian? Hmmm. Anti-war, if Female is being measured for a burka. Probably a smart idea. And, if the Palestinians don't like loosing farmland, then they can have fewer homicide bombers. |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-06-15 4:38:05 PM |
| #23 There is one truth that the Palestinians need to understand--sympathy for your suffering and your cause will only DECREASE by continuing with this "resistance". The barbarity of your homicide bombings convinces those with the power to help you that you are not worthy, are incapable of handling power. You are turning people AWAY from you with this intifada. The only real martyrs of the Palestinians will be the ones who die from refusing to join in barbarity. |
| Posted by: jules 187 2004-06-15 3:48:13 PM |
| #22 I saw pictures of the area in question. It must have been a stealth crop being farmed. |
| Posted by: Super Hose 2004-06-15 3:18:31 PM |
| #21 Does Israel pay for the land it appropriates for the wall, like a US jurisdiction does whenever private property is taken for public use? If Israel does, why doesn't anyone ever mention that? Scroll down to the lengthy post near the page's bottom: Did The Jews "Steal the Land?" by Robin • Friday February 20, 2004 at 12:31 AM It is a detailed and comprehensive account of what happened to the land currently in dispute. |
| Posted by: Zenster 2004-06-15 2:35:56 PM |
| #20 Brett - 1948 - some unsanctioned but condoned militia terrorsquads did some pretty awful things on behalf of the Israeli cause. The difference being that Ben Gurion cut them off at a certain point and said there can be only one locus of authority whereas the PA has never done that 1967 - running the bulldozers into Syria just to piss them off was a jackass move. They also lined up and shot a bunch of prisoners in several instances throughout the Sinai. It wasn't official policy but it was condoned. The Israelis also bombed and strafed the civilian refugee camps to try to get them to flee into the neighboring countries. Not the pinnacle of noble war. 1973 - The bulldozing of the Syrian Golan as Israel pulled out after the Kissinger-negotiated agreement was a sour move as well. No one's saying this amounts to anything resembling a holocaust or that the Palestinians hold relative moral superiority. But let's be honest: in the absolute sense, Israel's done some pretty awful things. And by being honest about that, we can say that Israel has changed somewhat for the better on this score. Unfortunately, the Palestinians seem headed in the other direction. |
| Posted by: Sawt al-Shebaab 2004-06-15 2:33:20 PM |
| #19 shipman---use "das" and it explains everything...heh heh. |
| Posted by: Alaska Paul 2004-06-15 2:16:55 PM |
| #18 the paleos were such a peaceful people before the jooows....got along just splendid with the brits, eyptians and jordanians... |
| Posted by: Dan 2004-06-15 1:59:18 PM |
| #17 the Zionists tortured and killed the Palestinians Antiwar, exactly WHEN and WHERE did this happen? I have read over 40 book on the 1948 war and have never heard of torture by the Jews. Now, the Jews did kill Palestinians (and Syrians and Lebanese and Egyptians), but then it was a defensive war. Maybe you should try reading (you know, using books) about history before you make such a stoopid claim. |
| Posted by: Brett_the_Quarkian 2004-06-15 1:49:29 PM |
| #16 Antisemite-- No, you leave that to khilafah.com and the rest of the jihadi websites your boyfriend lets you read. |
| Posted by: BMN 2004-06-15 1:45:58 PM |
| #15 [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted] |
| Posted by: Antiwar TROLL 2004-06-15 1:43:12 PM |
| #14 Antisemite-- Isn't it interesting that you're always referring us to jihadi websites? And how the Europeans and Arabs who did things like join SS brigades and republish Protocols of the Elders of Zion talk about how evil the Jews are? It's just SO interesting! |
| Posted by: BMN 2004-06-15 1:34:54 PM |
| #13 antiwar that is not nothing! you shuld see this intrasting website. it is show me truth of things and make it beter explain. |
| Posted by: muck4doo 2004-06-15 1:31:26 PM |
| #12 Yes, I can't wait until the Motzah Archipelago is make public..... yep. Crazed joooooos gasing the arabs in a futile attempt to conqueor ein hellhole. Or is that eine hellhole? Is it ein or eine AntiWar? |
| Posted by: Shipman 2004-06-15 1:27:23 PM |
| #11 Don't worry Antiwar - just blame the Brits for cocking it up in '48. |
| Posted by: Howard UK 2004-06-15 1:26:24 PM |
| #10 [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted] |
| Posted by: Antiwar TROLL 2004-06-15 1:20:04 PM |
| #9 I have AntiWar it's 99 and 78/100 percent allenist BS. |
| Posted by: Shipman 2004-06-15 1:13:04 PM |
| #8 [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted] |
| Posted by: Antiwar TROLL 2004-06-15 1:05:03 PM |
| #7 and moving your lips I bet |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-06-15 1:00:02 PM |
| #6 [Off-topic or abusive comments deleted] |
| Posted by: Antiwar TROLL 2004-06-15 12:53:07 PM |
| #5 it doesn't fit the agenda - yes they do pay, unless the confiscation/destruction of homes/orchards was necessitated by attacks |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-06-15 12:44:18 PM |
| #4 Doesn't matter Mike. Jooooos bought most of present day Israel before the nation was created and they own a chunk of the west bank too prior to the outlawing of land sales to jooooooooos From the arab standpoint its alwas been a voidable contract deal and they keep the money deal |
| Posted by: Shipman 2004-06-15 12:43:55 PM |
| #3 Does Israel pay for the land it appropriates for the wall, like a US jurisdiction does whenever private property is taken for public use? If Israel does, why doesn't anyone ever mention that? |
| Posted by: Mike 2004-06-15 12:38:57 PM |
| #2 Whatever became of Israel's announcement that they would begin to appropriate "Palestinian" land in retaliation for any deaths resulting from continued terrorist attacks? The concept sounded entirely logical. The remaining Palestinians might have |
| Posted by: Zenster 2004-06-15 12:31:11 PM |
| #1 The military released a statement saying the removal is in keeping with its policy to "to make a clear distinction between the terrorists who hide among civilians and those not involved in terror." Why bother? The Paleo "leadership" isn't inclined to even contemplate change unless pressure is brought to bear, so this means squeezing the Palestinian population as well. Deny them entry and keep them on their side of the fence. If that doesn't sound "compassionate", well, tough shit. No more of this dancing on both sides of the line. The Paleos need to make a decision; either they want to live in peace with Israel and reap the benefits, or they don't want to live in peace with Israel and they get nothing at all. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2004-06-15 11:32:31 AM |